Comments

This is so distressing. I, too, believe from my understanding of the Bible, that women should not be pastors over men. To follow one's beliefs and conscience and end up punished by the Law is so sad. The bigger problem here, though, is that we have now allowed the world to determine what we can and cannot do. If we had simply taken resolved the situation ourselves, then the courts wouldn't have been given permission to get involved. God forgive us all!

Dare any of you, having a matter against another, go to law before the unjust, and not before the saints? Do ye not know that the saints shall judge the world? And if the world shall be judged by you, are ye unworthy to judge the smallest matters? Know ye not that we shall judge angels? How much more things that pertain to this life? If then ye have judgments of things pertaining to this life, set them to judge who are least esteemed in the church.
I speak to your shame. Is it so, that there is not a wise man among you; no, not one that shall be able to judge between his brethren?

But brother goeth to law with brother, and that before the unbelievers.

Now therefore there is utterly a fault among you, because ye go to law one with another. Why do ye not rather take wrong? Why do ye not rather suffer yourselves to be defrauded?
1Co 6:1-7

Do you all remember that the first person Jesus greeted after the resurrection was a woman? Do you really think our great Lord could not choose to do what He wanted to do.

We have wars, aids, famine, rape, homelessness and so, so many other issues to deal with in this world. Now, we want to eliminate children of God who happen to be women?

Do you all remember that the first person Jesus greeted after the resurrection was a woman? Do you really think our great Lord could not choose to do what He wanted to do.

We have wars, aids, famine, rape, homelessness and so, so many other issues to deal with in this world. Now, we want to eliminate children of God who happen to be women?

It is outrageous that discrimination of any kind should be a criminal offense! Civil offense is what it should be! Although I disagree with those who think that no woman should hold a leadership over men, those who think otherwise should not be made criminals!

It is sad when a person cannot hold to personal convictions that are unpopular. And it will only get worse.

We Christians live is a world where religious plurality is king, and the only wrong is saying something is wrong. Some day we will get in trouble for saying there is only one way to God, through the Lord Jesus Christ. That will be regarded as "hate language." If Jeus Christ were here in the flesh He would be jailed for saying He was the only way to God, and that His Father was the only true God.

Perilous times indeed.

This is truly sad. As we disagree on specific teachings yet keep Christ at the center of our faith, and then to see that the government is brought into the mix, is very disconcerning. These are the very things we as Christians should be opposing openly and vocally. This is of course not spoken with a mean spirit or with intentions of revenge, but by being strong in the Lord and in the power of His might! I Cor. 2:5...that our faith should be not in the wisdom of man but in the power of God! Let us pray to that point.

Isn't it strange how the church refuses to recognize Jesus in the midst? That dear lady is a servant of Jesus, and if Jesus called her to ministry, who is man to prevent her from doing her job. If God chose a woman to carry His Son for nine months, who are we to say a woman cannot preach God's dear Son? May we help Jesus to tear down walls between male and female, and may we practice what Scripture teaches.

I was always taught that women could not pastor men, thus could not pastor the church. Now that there are more women in the ministry and co-pastors, etc, I struggle with this. My church is traditional and still does not have women in the ministry but personally I struggle with this. I really want to know if women can or can not be called to the ministry? When things are traditions and traditions change, we tend to accept it. Is this the case with women in the ministry? This subject just confuses me.

I feel extremely sorry for Pastor Ari Norro for at least three reasons.

The first is that it is a frightening thing that someone can be taken to court and fined for what is essentially a matter of religious belief, a matter of conscience. If the government of a country now believes that it has the right to decide religious matters, beginning with issues as problematic as this one, and one on which the Church in many jurisdictions is in disagreement, then Christianity in Finland may well be in serious danger.

What if this Church should one day turn down the application of a "sister" who is also a prostitute, for a Church position? What if it should decide that a practising homosexual cannot serve on its Board of Elders; and what if these matters should go to court? Could this same court not rule that these persons are being discriminated against as well?

Secondly, I also feel sorry for Petra Pohjanraito. Women in the Church are obviously caught between the rock of not wanting to hurt their Christian brothers or their Church, and that hard place of wanting to assume all the rights that society and the law have made possible. To me, this means that increasingly women will either take or leave, matters before the law courts relative to discrimination and equal rights.

Third and finally, I believe people must stand up for the things in which they believe. It is not like Pastor Norro does not have a choice. If he is strongly convinced that women should not lead in the Church then he ought to give serious consideration to leaving the Evangelical Lutheran Church of Finland and joining a fellowship of like-minded believers. If for whatever reason, (perhaps his livelihood) he is unable to leave, then in the light of the present court ruling, he will have to find some way to make peace with his conscience on the issue of women and Church leadership, or serve under protest and/or duress.

In any event, this is a sad day for Pastor Norro, The Evangelical Lutheran Church of Finland, and the Church of Jesus Christ in Finland.

The stable door is now open.

Policital correctness strikes again.

We seem to miss what is happening. This is a state church. State Churches are in decline because they are regulated by the state and because they are not competing for money or people.
I believe Ravi said, "If the state taxes you to support their religion, you can be sure they will tax your intelligence as well."

Sorry, I meant 'political'.

While I am of a denomination that ordains women, I can sympathize with the call for religiouse freedom. It seems to me though that the problem here is that it is a state church, why can't this guy just join an independent denomination, s[erate fropm ties with the Government?

While I am of a denomination that ordains women, I can sympathize with the call for religiouse freedom. It seems to me though that the problem here is that it is a state church, why can't this guy just join an independent denomination, s[erate fropm ties with the Government?

Perhaps this has more to do with the establishment of the Lutheran Church in Finland. An established church, I suspect, has a smaller margin of freedom from laws of this type.

Y'all need to read the article again. The law forbids discrimination, not just in the state church. Thus independent churches will be attatcked as well. It has happened again and again in history... it is happening again. Read the history of the Scottish Covanenters.

For Bernadette and others who struggle to understand the confusion within much of Chrisitianity on women's roles:

The most helpful brief reading I'd highly recommend as to the main source of the conflicts is in "The New Testament..." by Bart Ehrman, chapter 24 on women in the NT and early Christianity. I think it will clear up a lot of the confusion. However, if you read carefully and openly through this and the rest of the book (or many of hundreds of other scholarly works on Christian origins), you DO run the risk of becoming "confused on a higher level and about more important things" - one of the reasons conservative Christianity has gotten the mostly deserved reputation of being anti-intellectual. I, with Ehrman, am no longer an Evangelical, but still heartily agree that "...the truth shall set you free."

Gratefully,
Howard Pepper

Hello from Finland. I'm not a member of the Finnish Lutheran Church, but from the Evangelical Free Church. I think media has got this think distorted. One must note that priest Ari Norro is member of a movement inside church, and that this movement has bee acting like a church in itself for years. It was launched for worldwide evangelization, nowadays they seem to be more concerned about which is the best Bible translation, are women really allowed to be priests.

I guess they (this movement) are afraid to leave the State Church, maybe for their roots, but for funding also. They haven't recognized other free churches, claiming to have all the doctrines right (being ulta-Lutheran), so it would certrainly be difficult to became as one.

I think that the State Church has eventually done something for bringing order back to the Church. Although I must confess, that there have been some more serious events than this, when archbishop Jukka Paarma should had raised his voice, for example the case of priest Antti Kylliainen, who claims that all the people are going to be saved, because God is love, and others saying that there is no condemnation or Hell.

We must also note that the State Church is a public employer and it must follow the common laws concerning discrimination. It's not the same as setting an example that allows all open gays to be priests - I'm sure there are already many, who haven't made it public. The Church hasn't yet allowed homosexuals work as priests, and it has been almost 20 years since women were allowed - so it is only right for the Church to do this decision (to suit) according to it's conscience. If Church would allow all it's employees to behave according their personal consciences, we wouldn't only have women or gays as priests, but pedophiles also!

I agree that even if you feel that woman should not teach men that it is not so serious that you should break another rule of christianity that you should obey those appointed over you woman have been used by God in many ways many of those leadership roles I am not a big advocate of woman pastors but I think that it is ok in some situations.

The holy bible state,s and I qoute" I do not permit woman to have authority over a man." If it were not so , woman would have been made 'HEAD OF THE HOUSE HOLD. Men and woman are equally important and loved by our father in heaven. However we have all been given our roles in life from our maker.

WHAT WILL GOD'S PEOPLE DO NEXT?????

It is so unbelievable to hear that a church member would be so trivial to take another fellow christian to the "WORLD'S COURT SYSTEM" over something as "IMNATURE" as this.

The Body of Christ is really "DECAYING" in their "Image" as "True Believers" of God's Word, and so many "So called Christians" are doing things that they are determined to make "Gods Church" accept whether they want to or not.

This is a disgrace, not only for the "Body of Christ" but for those who have caused this situation to spin out of control to end up in a Court of Law.

Personally, I do not believe the "Courts of the Land" have anything to do with the "Rules" of God's Word, or the Church Rules that are established to govern the sound Christian operation and direction of "God's Church," and I hope that as this is taken to a higher Court of Law and that, God will show forth his Power in showing the "Courts of the Land" that, they do not have a "President" over God's Churches, and that they have no right to, and can not decide "Church Doctrine."

Those who uphold the "Word of God" and "God's Precepts and Laws" must "PRAY" and "FIGHT" this Disgrace by Voicing their disappointment of the "Courts" interference; and, the "Misconduct" of those who are determined to disregard God's Word.

We need to pray that those who "claim" to name the Name of Jesus must adhere to God's Word, and not "Their" Word.

God's Word Is True.

Disgusted!!!