I wonder why these protesters did not focus on the root cause - bribery and treachery being used to convert the gullible and poor. I have personally read several books printed by missionaries which make very derogatory remarks about Hindu Gods and culture. Clearly this is a violation of one's right to practice his religion in peace. Any violence is bad and we all must condemn it. However intelligent and reasonable people should go a step further and stop the root cause. Don't let loose the money power of a religion to degrade another religion. Remember Newton's law: Action and reaction are equal and opposite. While educated people like us just point out the obvious and don't do anything else, the more violent part of the population loses patience and resorts to violence.
The real culprits are those who go into another country with money bags and use immoral means to reach their fanatic goals. All this at a time when religion itself needs to be redefined in the light of modern scientific knowledge. Instead of increasing tensions by hurting others' religious beliefs, the "real peace seekers" would do well to keep their religion a private issue. There is but one God. We did not create him, he did. So whatever name we call him by is irrelevant and it's high time we stop fighting in the name of religion.
I did not know about this meeting discussed above. Else, I would have loved to go there and present my opinion.Again, all violence on those innocent people is barbaric and should never be tolerated. At the same time, help reduce this tension and achieve peace by respecting others' religion.

Respect is relevant as is seen so often in the latest movies. A warped sense of a code of honour and respect exists in the criminal world though they kill and torture. A warped sense of right and wrong exists for the people tortured under the Apartheid rule. A "moral" or rather a immoral sense of cleanliness existed for the Brahmins in the historic hindu world. A theological and ideological rightness existed for the Pharisees.
Truth is real and Yeshua was truth. Truth hurts. Why kick against the hurts.
If Ray thinks all conversions are bribery and treachery, he has not heard of a man (I knew) in a remote hovel in Oman knowing Christ in Sept 1986 and praying for his family back in his hometown. When he received an aerogramme (the next month!) from his family and read of their becoming Chrisitians, he was AMAZED at God's truth reaching so far. He understood the power of prayer and the long arm of God! Nothing is more unbelievable than Ray's mail indicating one's own rightness!! Protection and safe-guarding ones own faith was never an option with Christians. Its the joy of knowing a Supreme God and a relationship with Him that prompts real witness.
Ray has some truth in the statement that there are tensions caused by not respecting other faiths. However, right or wrong anyones thinking is, there is NO PLACE for violence, murder, rape or pillaging or ostracising based on CASTE nor RELIGION. This is what happened in historical India and is now revealed never to have left the Hindu mind. For many years and years, the dalits have stood by and been stepped on, now that they find a voice and a land they can call their own because of the Global community that wants to give and share their resources to the unfortunate and deprived, Ray prefers to call it bribery. The typical frog in the well culture of "if I cant have it, neither can you!!" Wake up and open peoples eyes to the real message, the dalits have been suffering for centuries under the Hindus and never been looked at. Now that the Christians are teaching and educating them, Christ- Himself is giving them a stand - "making a nation out of them" (understand the allegory of the Israelite slaves in Egypt" and the attitudes of the local Egyptians at that time)......Hindus are rallying against real progress of the downtrodden. All those who stand AGAINST THE POOR AND THE DEPRIVED are against Christ. There can be privacy of our religion but not of our Faith. Let your light so shine that people may see your good works and praise the Father in Heaven.

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I believe brother Philip is right. I have great admiration for Mahatma Gandhi. He did great things on behalf of Bharat. I know he also inspired Pastor Martin Luther King, Jr. to conquest civil rights to black people in America. Once Mr. Ghandi said that He appreciated our Christ but not our christianity.

Well, you need know the other side of the Ghandi's idiossincrazy. He said:"In India one finds that conversions brings about deep disdain for one's old religion and its followers, i.e., one's old friends and one's relatives. The next change that takes place is that of dress and manners and behaviours. All that does great harm to the country."

Another hindu man, Babasaheb Ambedkar, said that by joining Islam or Christianity, the Depressed Classes would 'not only go out of the Hindu religion, but also go out of the Hindu culture....Conversion to Islam or Christianity will denationalise the Depressed Classes.In short, Dalits should remain "untouchables" for the rest of their lives, forever and ever washing latrines and to go hungry in the name of one "karma".

Ghandi and Ambedkar agree in one point: in the name of culture or Hindu religion, 200.000.000 Dalits from the low class, that depressed class must be in their same miserable lifes. That it is a "disdain" to old Hindu culture.

I think we have here a misunderstood. Hungry, caste division, slavery is not culture - to me. It is opression. Blessed be the name of Jesus, for John 8:32 "If you know the truth, you will be free"

Did you know why some hindu fundamentalists is blazing churches and killing pastors since last Christmas? Because the Truth hurts! For every missionary they burn - like VHP fundamentalist know more to do - more disciples will be send to Orissa. They could fire many boodies and put down many churches "in the name of culture" but I know that there will ever be a man or woman there in Orisso to say Jesus saves, Jesus forgives, and Jesus is the Prince of the Peace.

Shame on those false indigenous that kill their brothers with hungry and see their children poverty while steal their hope and step on their dreans with that big lie of low caste!

Every Hindu has the right to his culture and religion. But only Jesus Christ can bring prosperity to Bharat.

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I think we are just in the End times,

The real fact is that India is not a democracy,and to say it is the worlds largest democracy is a misnomer.India is an oligarhy.Families rule the country. They were there at the grant of Independance and are still there at the top.India has the democratic structures,The constitution is not Hindu,but is christian in structure,but it does not work,because the majority find nothing in common with it,so if missionaries want to liberate the downtrodden and in the process want to upset the top castes the entire issue gets relegated to a law and order problem.The Courts can intervene suo moto when the christians are being attacked,but bring it to the level of a law and order problem and there is no question of intervening and saying those who have lost their properties or are burnt alive ,in this 21st centuryetc,etc,is to repeat that Nero fiddled while Rome burnt,.This is exactly what is happening around the globe..Be sure, nobody is botherd if these 18/19 million are lost,nobody bothered in the West or the U.S when millions are killed in Africa.The best way to help, is focus on the real issue.India has slipped into the lap of FASCISTS gradually from 1988 onwards and today one hears the death sounds of the congress Party,which incidentally is the Party which has fathered the largest number of anti christian so called Freedom of religion Bills ,the latest being the Himachal Pradesh Bill.Fascists are delivering the last final punch to the dead demcracy structure.We have to get the U.N. to intervene and pick up the Fascists for trial at the Haague .Before that we must get as many in the Christian L.American ,African ,Western and U.S to send studyn teams to Orissa ans M.P. and Karnatak,etc to make reportsd and see for themselves .Stop squabbling about negotiating with these Fascists.If it is necessary for them to use nuclear power they will do so and justify it in the name of saving the ancient vedic structure,if anyone survives.Understand it India is the worlds largest sick democratic structure,ande Christians and muslims have no place in it..

As an Indian Christian, deeply committed to the tenets of Jesus of Nazareth, I must condemn without reservation the lies perpetrated by Joso Gruzue's comments which I quote here :"Ghandi and Ambedkar agree in one point: in the name of culture or Hindu religion, 200.000.000 Dalits from the low class, that depressed class must be in their same miserable lifes. That it is a "disdain" to old Hindu culture"

Sir, please be decent and honest enough to cite a source from where I can read the basis of your quotes. Bearing false witness is un-Christian.

As a Christian, I have learned first to look at the pillar in my own eyes before I point to the mote in my neighbor's.

If the Jehadi Muslims and the Talibanic Christians will cease and desist from their relentless campaigns in a race to either convert the entire planet to become an Islamic theocracy or a Christian Kingdom through your respective "shameless" conversion campaigns either through overt or covert means of enticements, we will have more peace and respect for each other's faith.

India's Hinduism has for over three thousand years given a haven to Jews, Christians from the times of even before Europe was Christianized, pre-Mughal Muslims in Kerala, Syrian Christians in kerala, Parsis in Gujarat, Sikhs, Buddhists, Jains, Bahais etc..without any reservations. It is only with the advent of mass conversion attempts by either enticement or coercion that the Jehadi Muslims, and the Talibanic (evangelicals) Christians have stoked the emergence of Bajrang Dal and other fanatical elements within Hinduism to counteract the eagerness of both Islam and Christianity to either Christianize India or Islamize that nation.

No wonder, it breeds violence. Let us look within ourselves as Christians and ask what has been the roles of Christian missionaries in instigating insurgencies in Nagaland, Mizoram, Meghalaya etc when the majority of population in those states became Christians. Likewise, Assam and Ksshmir are seeing their share of Islamic militancy in a nation that has been a patient and resilient secular nation since its very founding.

If Indian Christians and Indian Muslims do not rise up against unbridled attempts to convert Hindus into either Christians or Muslims, we will have no one to blame but ourselves.

Our parents taught us how they lived in India in harmony and peace. Yes we live in their land, that does not mean that it is not our country. all Christians lived in a land not their own. We have a home and an eternal country. Whether I live in India or in Israel or in Brazil or Australia, I am a Christian first and a foreigner.
The Bible tells us to live in submission to Authorities of that land. "Render unto Ceaser..." We are always two citizens. So in effect we need to be humble and learn like Gandhi in MASS RALLIES for peace, ahimsa was a way and is exactly what was taught by Jesus. If you are slapped, offer the other cheek.(not cheekily!)
I know it hurts, I dont live in Orissa and I can empathise with those who have lost their belongings or lost their loved ones and the difficulty they have in showing love and peace. I believe that after Graham Staines martyrdom, Gladys has returned to Orissa to show that same love. This is the example that will speak volumes rather than frustrated anger and vitriol. Christians returning to their homes even after having been told to get out are not like dogs returning with a tail tucked but they have their heads held up and willing to face persecution to stand with Jesus in the Pilates Courtyard with all the soldiers whipping and spitting and cursing him.
Bible says to show mercy, truth, love and forgiveness as this is what will speak like JESUS in today's vicious world of hate and revenge.

I just returned from India and the talk about what is happening in Orissa is all over the Christian community there. The previous comments about this being the fault of Christians are ludicrous. Everywhere I traveled in the holy cities along the Ganges, I saw Hindus attempting to convert Westerners to the teachings of Hinduism. No one complained or thought it was out of bounds. If Indian Christians are trying to convert others, so what? What do Hindus have to fear? The truth is that the militant fundamentalist Hindus will tolerate no view but their own and they fear other viewpoints because they know that the people are sick of their tyranny. Their so-called tolerance is a mask for hatred and violence and they say that they are against conversion, but they threaten death to those who will not renounce their faith in Jesus Christ. Are they not trying to convert Christians back to Hinduism? They are liars and murderers. The confusion that I have seen propogated in this comment stream under the guise of sophisticated thought is appalling.

Alan, you are spot on in your understanding that some of what has been said within the context of "this comment stream" is rather contradictory - but not all. As an indigenous Christian (not to India but to my heritage in Christ), I can also empathize with what was said by Norona Vivian about the real issue being the rule of fascism in the state of Orissa because the caste system is used by the ruling class as a means of keeping the oppressed classes subjugated to the whims and tyrannies of a Brahminical autocracy clothed in the deceitful guise of a parliamentary democracy. Paramilitary occupations and sequesterings of territories are common in this place - Christians are robbed of their land rights and cultural freedoms and this is clearly a case of indigenous people being forcibly denied cultural rights and decency of livelihood through such acts of violence and repression. Mining companies and their bargaining agreements with the Orissan government are also behind much of the extremist violence as they tend to fund resource extraction projects supported by pro-neoliberal development agendas which are also in turn advocated staunchly by the extreme right-wing Hindu fundamentalist parties. This repression is a backlash against the successes of various progressive forces because the hierarchical mainstay of the caste system is actively being challenged by indigenous Christian communities and popular political movements who favour liberation of/for oppressed sectors. I advocate a broad alliance be built between miscellaneous indigenous rights campaigns, progressive political movements and the indigenous Christian community there to actively strategize against the hostilities because it is important for people the world over to mobilize against all forms of oppression as one of the most basic tenets of Christian culture is the eradication of oppressive/unjust systems of rulership. This does not mean we pick up bombs and blow up our human opponants - but what it does mean is that we actively counteract these regimes, these principalities and powers, where we can and in ways that are culturally affirming and liberating for all whom we encounter. Some forms of non-violent direct action such mass road blockades and rallies etc are useful means of demonstrating the power of our collaborative efforts to uphold and cherish who God has created us to be as well as a public statement of outcry over unjust systems of governance and authority. These means also serve to further educate the general public about issues they may otherwise turn a blind eye to.

I also must commend others who have previously commented where indeed they have condemned the violence and have decided in their hearts to take a stand of solidarity with brothers and sisters who are currently engaged in a struggle of utmost severity, one which needs urgent international intervention. We call on the leaders of India to look at both the significance of the UN Human Rights Charter and the Declaration of the Rights of Indigenous Peoples and to acknowledge that this situation is in direct contravention of those international agreements. According to the United Nations General Assembly's News and Media division, India's national government voted in favour of the passing of the UN Declaration on the Rights of Indigenous Peoples (September 2007) Considering this, they have a duty to uphold the articles in this declaration by actively denouncing the violence in the state of Orissa and exercising measures to compensate those affected, and redress the situation by bringing to the UN international court the proponents and perpetrators of these atrocities.

The main culprits financing these terrorists are Hindus in USA. They send money to these organizations. The hate based group like VHP has shakas (branches)in USA.
Hindus play race card in USA but happily side with these fanatics.

Those who are concerned about India and Christianity in India.
Hinduism flourished and survived for so many years. Hindu philosophy is vegetarionism, non vilence, tolerence etc.. to name a few.
The religions originated in the middle east(islam, christianity etc...) are teaching vilence and they are concerned about conversion and dividing peace loving communities. In India christians occupy only 2.3 percent of the total population. There are several churches around my place and every Sunday they preach(brain wash) people that non- christians are satans. Even kids are brain washed with their narrow minded and idiotic teachings.
In US during 911 several Indians were killed because they were non christians. Why people practising christinity are talking about black, white, hispanic, cathlic and protestent etc.. Why USA nuked Japan. Why Muslims are attacked all over the world and vice versa. Predominantly catholic Northern Ireland was fighting protestent England. Why???. It's the same religion isn't it. Why christian whites are so racist. Is christianity only meant for whites??? It's all about common sense and the sixth sense isn't it. Animals does not have that sixth sense and so the followers of the middle eastern religions. The British massacred 100s of thousands of Indians who refused to convert to christiantity. What kind of a religion is that which asks it's followers to kill. Why Mormons. Why Warren Jeffs who raped minors. What kind of a religion is that. What kind of follwers of a religion who seduced and sodomized males and paid 600 million dollars. Once a pope said India is going to suffer a lot because they are Hindus. That was during a hurricane season. Which religion he belongs to. Think people think and convert to peace locing and preaching religions like Hinduism or Budhdhism. They don't do forcible conversions or divide a community based on religion.

Do some Simple researches. What Christianity has done to india.
1.) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Goa_Inquisition

I think peace between all religions in india should be out main concern.the only way to have peace is for all religions to respect one another,obey the anti-conversion laws,and put a stop to hindu extremists by posting security personel around each church,and orphanege.There seems to be more hondus than christians in india.Hindus should respect a persons right to believe christianity if they choose to.Peace between religions is the only way to decrease the violence in india.We need to be peacemakers,and let God do the rest;