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July 9, 2010

PCUSA General Assembly Votes Not to Redefine Marriage (Updated)

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Hours after voting in favor of permitting practicing homosexuals to serve in the clergy, the General Assembly of the Presbyterian Church (USA) decided to keep their definition of marriage "as being between a man and a woman," the Associated Press reports.

The Minneapolis Star-Tribune wrote early this morning that the Assembly voted to allow the church two more years to study the proposal. (Corrected)

Had the proposal passed, the PCUSA could have become the largest US denomination to permit same-sex marriage, the Baptist Press reported earlier this week.

Update: James Berkley, designated pastor at Seattle's Bethel Presbyterian Church, explains the decision.

The business on marriage was byzantine and bizarre, but what happened is that both the majority and the minority reports of the special committee on same-sex unions will go out to the churches to study. None of the efforts to change constitutional language from “a man and a woman” to “two people” even got debated. They got “answered” as a batch by the actions on sending out the study. I wouldn’t have bet a plug nickel that that would have happened.

Update (9:15 a.m.): Carmen Fowler, the president of the Presbyterian Lay Committee, spoke with CT this morning.

"I would say that I was surprised," Fowler said of the decision, "and I will just openly admit that. The assembly acted very faithfully in terms of what Scripture says and in terms of the heritage of the church...that's great. It was a wonderful way for the assembly to respond to very, very controversial business that certainly many in the church would have responded to disfavorably."

Fowler attributes the surprise decision to "a genuine movement of the Spirit."

"I don't know how else to account for it," she said. "There were some very compelling arguments made on the floor of the Assembly. I would say the most compelling ones came from racial/ethnic commissioners."

Several in the General Assembly noted yesterday that Presbyterians in the Global South have strongly conservative views on homosexual issues.

"We do try to listen in the Presbyterian Church to voices other than just an Anglo culture," Fowler said. "I think that moderates are not used to hearing those voices spoken in a conservative manner."

She also points to an "incredible" ecumenical greeting from the Orthodox Reverend Siarhei Hardun of Belarus.

"He just made all the right points," Fowler said. "If you're going to be instructed at a church gathering by a faithful witness from another part of the world, it does have the power to change minds and change hearts."

Comments

Are the homosexuals in the clergy abstaining from homosexual sex or still practicing homosexual sex. I'm not about to listen to someone tell me about sin while they're committing the worst sin themselves.
Jesus' love is the Ten Commandments not accepting and approving the sin of any one. Where are the leaders in the churches, all we have is followers who say nothing about abortion, won't stand up to practicing homosexuals, we have nothing but cowards accepting the movement of the moment and the worst thing, they're in positions to sholve it down everybody else's throats. No matter how many times we in the pews vote against the sins the people voting at the national level aren't listening. When the pews become empty, will they listen then, no, because they'll have what they've been after, to practice whatever sin it is that they personally are after getting accepted in the church.

Hopefully they will continue to uphold marriage and not be drawn into heresy like so many others.

Here is the text of what the Orthodox priest said to us. He was like the angel standing in front of Balaam, telling him not to curse the people of God. May God send us many more such faithful prophets!!

"I was really struck while listening to your discussion about homosexuality, same-sex marriage, civil unions and other moral issues. Christian morality is as old as Christianity itself. It doesn’t need to be invented now. Those attempts to invent new morality look for me like attempts to invent a new religion – a sort of modern paganism.

"When people say that they are led and guided by the Holy Spirit to do it, I wonder if it is the same Spirit that inspired the Bible, if it is the same Holy Spirit that inspires the Holy Orthodox Church not to change any doctrinal or moral standards? Is it really the same Spirit or perhaps there are different spirits acting in different denominations and inspiring them to develop in different directions and create different theologies and different morals?

“My desire is that all Christians should contend earnestly for the faith, which was once for all delivered to the saints, as St. Jude calls us to do (Jude 1:3). And my advice as an Ecumenical Advisory Delegate is the following: 'Do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewing of your mind.’” (Romans 12:2).

Somewhat incredible speech by the Orthodox Father. Highly recommend watching this in its entirety - he basically said "we have kept the faith unchanged for 2000 years - you should not go down the path you are on." These Eastern European Orthodox are, frankly, the most amazing witnesses to the faith I have encountered.

We have recklessly come to a time in the history of the church that desires to hear and follow teachers that suit fleshly lifestyles and beliefs. 2 Timothy 4:3 There is only truth not some other form of it. We can always stretch or distort truth but the gay and lesbian practices are unacceptable as biblical prescriptions to healthy culture. We need only ask the question what would Christ be? Can he be homosexual? Can he be drunk or a drug addict? Would he be a child molester or sex addict? God forbid. But does he love them and deliver them from their condition, of course but without accepting that they will be go unchanged.

To "christian": You state " ... all christians should contend earnestly for the faith which was once and for all delivered..."
So what about continuing revelation? What about the very foundational concept of the reformed faith "reformed always reforming". If truth was given and the book closed then both these ideas are heresy yet the church has always accepted that God has the freedom to continue revelation to his creation as he wills. Sorry but i find it the hight of hubris to claim you have the final, unchangable will of god in your possession and the rest are heretics. Even the scripture you quote has more to do with transformation, ie change, than being stuck in one place.

Elder
New Jersey

It's unfortunate this decision was made.
Very exclusionary.

I think if we as a church want to continue to impact our world, we do need to continue to evolve and realize that just because someone is gay, does not mean they canot Love and Worship Jesus.
Legally, if the State is going to recognize common law relationships, why not gay ones? Gay relationships are no different that common law ones.. the only difference is straight common law people have the option of marrying one another.. gays do not.

The Archbishop from Belarus spoke with the authority of his church. Funny, they do not acknowledge the Trinity, yet we are ready to accept his word as truth? I do not know where to find the information that homosexuality is the 'worst' sin. I missed that in my reading of scripture. Gossip is a sin..are there one among us that do not commit that sin frequently? Even those in the pulpit?. Ah, well. I believe the Holy spirit can be about his business whenever and wherever his people gather. And they were gathered in Minneapolis.

Because as Christians, we are new creatures in Christ, we should have an absolute hatred of all sin.(most of all the sin that resides in us) Therefore, we should continue to fight against and denounce all sin with the power of our triumphant Lord Jesus Christ. To "practice" any sin and still serve as a leader of the flock of Christ is to bring about devastation upon oneself and all those who follow. We must "count ourselves as dead to sin, but alive to God In Christ Jesus" and to not "let sin rule in our mortal bodies". Romans 6:11, 12 May we continue to uphold God's truth embodied in His word and obey by faith what He has spoken for our good and His glory.!

In response to Tadd's post of July 13. Interesting you should bring up the issue of State acknowledgment of common-law spouses.Just because something is legal does not mean it is moral or Biblical.
Common-law spouses is law of expediency and has more to do with separation than unification. By making a relationship subject to common-law, the dissolution of the relationship can be sorted out.
Jesus disapproved of common-law relationships. He spoke to the Samaritan woman at the well and revealed her sin to her (gently but certainly didn't give it His stamp of approval) and described how she had had several commmon-law relationships but she was by no means married. "Legal" is a worldly issue, "Moral" a Godly one.

In response to Rosella's post of July 15: You would apparently be surprised to learn that the Archpriest and all Orthodox Christians do "acknowledge" and indeed, worship the Holy Trinity; so much so, in fact, that we actually believe what Christ said in Holy Scripture: "But when the Comforter is come, whom I will send unto you from the Father, even the Spirit of truth, which proceedeth from the Father, he shall testify of me." (John 15:26) It is the Presbyterians and other western Christians who have inserted new language (the 'filioque') into the ancient Creed, disrespecting the very words of Christ Himself.

This debate about whether marriage should not even be happening. There is not a shread of doubt that is should only be between a man and woman who love each other.