At the heart of the so-called “Gay Gospel”, or “Gay Theology”, is the claim that the Bible does not condemn homosexual acts that occur within the context of loving, committed, enduring homosexual relationships. This, despite the fact that the Bible does appear to condemn all homosexual acts and that the Christian church has steadfastly held this position since Jesus Christ established His church almost 2,000 years ago. In effect, what gay theology is asking, rhetorically, is, “Did God really say that sex within the context of loving, committed, long-term homosexual relationships is wrong?” If the phrase “Did God really say…” sounds familiar to you, it is probably because that is exactly what Satan said to Eve in the Garden of Eden when he was trying to get her to commit the first sin: “Now the serpent was more crafty than any of the wild animals the Lord God had made. He said to the woman, “Did God really say, ‘You must not eat from any tree in the garden’?” (Genesis 3:1). And that is exactly what is happening in the Christian church today, in the form of gay theology. Satan is using gay theology to get Christians who are homosexual to continue to practice homosexuality and feel good about it, rather than repent of it.

This is a church made of a stone building with places for entombment of the dead above ground. Surely Yeshua would say the dead are leading the dead directly into Hell.

These churches are now false teachers. Being gay and being a "leader" in the church is an Oxymoron and they are no longer credible messengers for the word of God. In the bible it clearly says that homosexuality is a sin. So, if you are openly living a sin every day of your life then you are not living the word of God and have no business representing yourself has a leader to others. This is twisting the word of God.

The interesting thing, of course, is that Jesus Christ never said word one about homosexuality, gay relationships, etc., etc. All the homophobic rhetoric was invented by St. Paul.

JC

One can only say that the "rhetoric was invented by St. Paul" if one truly believes that the Holy Spirit wasn't the voice behind the entirety of scripture. If you believe that scripture is inerrant and that it all came directly/indirectly from God, then Paul's involvement becomes irrelevant. If you believe that scripture was written directly by man though, then you can of course conveniently pick & choose what you'd like to believe & what you'd prefer to ignore by simply saying that God didn't say that particular verse. The Bible then becomes a convenient tool for supporting whatever your own personal ideology is.

The stone that the builders rejected has now become the cornerstone. Let he who is without sin cast the first stone. Judge not and you shall not be judged. With that judgement that you judge, so shall you be judged. beware of judging others because you do the very same things yourselves.

How do you have 15 candidates and 4 of them are gay? That is 26%. Most surveys put the figure at 4%. This is over 6 times the average for the population. Someone is scheming to stack the deck in favor of homosexuals in a bid to dominate the church.

These people have convinced the weak ones in the churches that they are just people, just like everybody else. In fact, a survey was done of all the sex cases of priests that 82% were boys past puberty, the rest were adult women, teen girls, boys and girls(pedaphiles and a surprising .3% probably because small kids are usually near their parents or teachers or groups. The Catholic churches let their guard down from the 40s on but are now testing, studying their new priests in seminary. Our churches let their guard down and are now having what happened in the Catholic churches happen in our churches. Once they're in it's hard to get rid of them because they are so mouthy and bullies so members simply leave or put up with them by staying away from them. Jesus didn't discuss homosexuals because it was known by Jews as wrong and God would settle with them, while on earth, as long as they kept to themselves they were left to themselves. The mained, prostitutes, sick etc. were the ones brought to Jesus, because they were out in the open or known about. Knowing the laws and culture of the Jewish makes what type of questions Jesus was confronted with and answered understandable. Christians of today can't seem to answer homosexuals or have the strength to stand up to them, they just leave the Church and the homosexuals win, on earth. Paul had the strength and eventually paid with his life.

Too often, Bible-believing Christians get labeled as promoters of hatred for their literal take on God's word. I won't deny that there are people out there who hate homosexuals & try to use the Bible to support their hatred/discrimination/etc... their behavior is shameful. If, in God's eyes, our righteousness is as "filthy rags" & a jealous thought is as much a sin as murder, then we know we all equally deserve to go to hell. Apart from God's grace, there are no redeeming qualities within any of us that make anyone more worthwhile than the next person. Since we are commanded to love one another & to spread the truth of God's word, knowing that we are ALL equally wretched & undeserving recipients of His mercy, I would not presume to look down on anyone. However, there is a difference between looking down on someone from a pedestal you've put yourself on & accurately discerning how well someone's viewpoint lines up with the truth of scripture. The latter allows you to speak the truth to them in love (Ephesians 4:15) & confront your brother about his sin (Matthew 18:15). Therefore, "I can do nothing on my own. As I hear, I judge, and my judgment is just, because I seek not my own will but the will of him who sent me." - John 5:30

Thank you for reporting on the election of our new moderator without adding commentary or passing judgements.

I am a United Church of Canada minister, heterosexual, married for more than 30 years with adult children. I have a number of colleagues who are gay or lesbian who have served the church with dedication. None are paedophiles, one of the disturbing fallacies of those opposed to gays and lesbians in leadership. In fact, after many years of ordaining and commissioning gays and lesbians in our denomination there has never been a reported instance of attacks on children.

Our new moderator, Gary Paterson, did not run on the basis of his orientation. He has been in a committed same gender relationship for 30 years and married since it became legal in Canada. The press has picked up on his orientation.

There is no "so-called Gay Gospel" in the United Church. There is a commitment to equality and inclusion which we feel reflects the gospel of Jesus Christ.

@Don Schaefer: One can only say that the "rhetoric was invented by St. Paul" if one truly believes that the Holy Spirit wasn't the voice behind the entirety of scripture. If you believe that scripture is inerrant and that it all came directly/indirectly from God, then Paul's involvement becomes irrelevant.

Actually, no, it becomes a matter of priorities.

If the Holy Spirit had considered homosexuality a really critical, make-or-break issue, the Spirit -- and Jesus Himself -- would surely have considered it important enough to address explicitly, instead of leaving the matter to the discretion of the great but human St. Paul.

One doesn't entrust the game-winning touchdown to one's 3rd-string wide receiver ...

... unless one is an incompetent Coach.

JRC

@Don Schaefer: If, in God's eyes, our righteousness is as "filthy rags" & a jealous thought is as much a sin as murder, then we know we all equally deserve to go to hell.

But, of course, until the sheep are separated from the goats, homophobic, gay-hating Christians need some group or other to feel superior to, like the Pharisee in the Temple who saw the publican praying, and what better group than gay / lesbian people?

So homophobic and gay-hating Christians, like the Pharisee, say "I thank you, Lord, that I am not like that homosexual ... "

"There is nothing new under the sun" -- Qoheleth

JRC

@Rick: How do you have 15 candidates and 4 of them are gay? That is 26%. Most surveys put the figure at 4%. This is over 6 times the average for the population. Someone is scheming to stack the deck in favor of homosexuals in a bid to dominate the church.

With all due respect, Rick, you need to learn some statistics.

The entire population of the denomination hardly constitutes a statistically significant sample out of a Nation of 330 million.

If your sample size is small enough relative to the whole population, then random results can look very un-random.

JRC

@James R. Cowles until the sheep are separated from the goats, homophobic, gay-hating Christians need some group or other to feel superior to


I'm sorry that you feel that way, as it is an opinion that certainly doesn't reflect well on the Christians (myself included) who you've interacted with thus far. We are all born with hearts that are full of wicked & selfish thoughts and the inclination to sin in different ways. While I can't speak for anyone else, I can honestly say that I don't believe the sin in my life is any more/less an eyesore to God than the sin someone enters into when they have homosexual relations with others. As a matter of fact, if it weren't for scripture, I would likely think my sins were worse, as I wouldn't consider homosexual activity as anything but a different personal preference that wasn't practical for reproductive purposes. From a human standpoint, it certainly doesn't have any of the negativity/pain/hurt/etc. associated with lying, murder, stealing, etc.

However, God does refer to it quite negatively in a number of passages throughout scripture, and we know that apart from Christ, any/all sin keeps us from heaven, so I have to assume that at least in that respect, all sin is equal. While I believe everyone should be invited to Christ & shown love, regardless of the sin(s) they struggle with, it is the responsibility of the believer to lovingly identify sin as such when they see it (in private if possible so as to avoid embarrassing anyone). If someone in my church saw me committing an act that God identified as sin, I would fully expect them to confront me on it & ask that I work on it if I wanted to stay in their church body. Similarly, I would expect anyone else who is truly seeking God's will for their lives to allow themselves to be held to the same expectation, especially if they are in a leadership role.

While I personally believe all sins are equal for the reasons I mentioned, I do know of scripture that could be interpreted to indicate that some sins are worse than others (apart from the logic-based argument that you made about Christ & St. Paul) & I can agree to respectfully disagree with you on that point, as I don't think it's a difference that factors into foundational theological doctrines.

This is a sad indictment on this denomination. Tolerating any open deliberate sin in a church leader is contrary to the Gospel message, which names sins and calls us to repent of them. Some of the comments reveal bitter hatred towards homosexuals, that needs repentance too. Jesus DID affirm marriage as heterosexual (Matt 19:4-6), citing God's original creation of male and female. Gen 1:27 affirms that heterosexual humankind reflects the image of God, which same-sex human unions can never do. Unlike one's Race, Sexual Orientation is a choice, and that choice is sinful and can be repented of. (If it were genetic it would have phased out of the gene-pool millenia ago). So the credibility of the UCC as a standard-bearer of the Gospel is ruined, and this should be mourned by all Christians.

JRC, Ah, so the gender preferences of the pool of moderators to choose from is a statistical anomaly based in the disparity of sample size! That’s one explanation. In reality there should be no Moderators running for office who are homosexuals, not four out of fifteen. Paul recommended the elders be husband of one wife and insisted in several places that homosexuality is sin. He wrote the Roman Church that lesbian and homosexual acts represent the end result of rebellion and they are called “shameful” several times. But of course, if you don’t believe the New Testament books of Paul were inspired, go ahead and ignore them. Jude, the brother of Jesus calls sodomy “sexual perversion”, “don’t forget Sodom and Gomorrah and their neighboring towns, which were filled with immorality and every kind of sexual perversion.” He says they went after "strange flesh." But if you don’t believe Jude was inspired, ignore him too. Peter says God made an example of Sodom and Gomorrah for indulging the flesh in its corrupt desires. But you know what, I’d ignore Peter too. Goes without question I’d ignore Leviticus and Deuteronomy as well. See, now you have a shiny new religion all based on whatever you feel like! Groovy.

While I originally thought JRC was implying that homosexuality wasn't sin & that Paul's writings weren't inspired, I think the subsequent posts he made revealed that he was making a case for his belief that there are greater sins than homosexuality that people should be focused on more important things. While I will maintain that homosexuality IS sin & as such, needs to be condemned along with all other sins, I think we should be careful not to assume that JRC is coming from one angle or another until he himself has clarified that.

JRC, why do you claim the Holy Spirit doesn’t address homosexuality explicitly in the Bible? You can’t get much more explicit than Paul describing the shame of lesbian women having sex with each other and homosexual men having sex together and saying that it not only is sin, but that it violates nature in Romans Chapter 1. That’s the theology. Then the practical, pastoral counsel is contained in 1 Corinthians 9 where Paul says that practicing homosexuals will not inherit the Kingdom of God. Or 1st Timothy 1:10 where Paul says that practicing homosexuals are in defiance of the laws of God and His clear teaching. Or Jude, the brother of Jesus in verse 7 or Peter in 2nd Peter 2:10. Or Moses writing in several places warning against men who have sex with each other or prohibitions against cross dressings.

If Paul is merely human as you say, if he is a 3rd string wide receiver who can’t be trusted to bring in the touchdown (?), If Jude is unrelIable, if Peter’s words can’t be trusted, if Moses can’t be trusted then I guess you throw it all out but the 4 gospels. However, how do you know the Holy Spirit was speaking through the greek journalist Luke who never even met Jesus or Mark who also never met Jesus and is only recording Peter’s memories.

What is this kneejerk “Homo-phobic” accusation about? Was Paul Homophobic? Was he a gay-hater? Why would he say gays would not inherit the kingdom of God...sounds pretty harsh. Was Moses Homophobic? Was he a gay-hater? Jesus specified marriage was between a man and a woman, was He homophobic too? Let us know who is homophobic. Perhaps as Don says, you could clarify to us what is inspired and who the homophobes are.

With "church" friends like the United Church of Canada who needs atheists and agnostics? At least those two say there is no God, or they cannot say for certain that there is a God. The UCC, and others like it, seem to be saying, as it relates to homosexuality, we can make the Bible say whatever we want it to say.

So they tell us that their new moderator Gary Paterson has been in a committed "same gender" relationship for 30 years. In other words he has been living a lie not in any way sanctioned by the Christian bible, but that is good enough for the UCC. In fact, if it was not him in the moderator' chair it could have been several others just like him.

It is time those who are faithful to the truth "once for all entrusted to the saints" face the truth, that organisations like UCC which have sprung up all across North America, have ceased to be Churches of Jesus Christ in any real sense, but are simply social clubs whose members live out their particular libertarian sexual fantasy.

For denying the rightful place of male and female in the family, and for establishing alternative sexual relationships not ordained of God, and until and unless they see the error of their futility, we may soon have to classify such institutions as "cults" -movements that deny this basic tenet of orthodox, historic scriptural teaching that the "two shall become one flesh".