Hermenuetics

Comments

I don't think that anyone really can "make sense" of shootings like these, because there is no sense to them. From what I've read about this situation, it appears that Sodini had serious psychological issues that were most likely undiagnosed. It is gravely unfortunate that he escaped the notice and intervention of the mental health and legal systems (the legal system only narrowly, as he was questioned by police during the week prior to the shooting based on a report that he had carried a grenade onto a city bus).

I don't believe that Sodini was in any way a "typical" case; many, many men are "sexually frustrated" and it's fair to guess that a significant number also have an irrational hatred toward women in general. This sort of thing happens only very, very rarely, however. With that said, I do believe that our American culture does seemingly encourage disturbed individuals to committ mass shootings by virtue of the wall-to-wall news coverage that it gives to them - this provides the perverse "glory" that most of these sociopaths seem to be seeking.

Ideally, the focus of news coverage, when these henious acts are committed, should be on the tradegy and on the victims - not on the details of the killers' lives and their motivations.

Posted By: Dan | August 12, 2009 11:45 AM

For sure, there is no excuse for mass murder, and it should be condemned as strongly as possible. However, deep inside Sodini there is probably a good gentleman yearning to be discovered by a woman who is willing to give a chance to a "nice guy". Unfortunately, women nowadays are only interested in "bad boys", which explains why so many Christian women are involved with non-Christian men, among other things. Sodini's attempt to be "bad" crossed the line significantly and seriously went too far, but the outcome would have been much more for the better if only one woman would give him a chance to demonstrate how he is potentially a wonderful husband for any lady.

Posted By: James | August 12, 2009 4:23 PM

Interesting to hear the deacon's comment about once saved, always saved and that the shooter is in heaven, but not getting his rewards. Being "saved" requires ongoing, lifetime work or else salvation is a joke and a lie. Being saved requires LIVING in Christ, and when you turn from Christ, then you have rejected his salvation. I have never been able to understand a salvation guaranteed for anyone who speaks one way, then lives another. If hell is not for the mass murderers, the baby killers, the Hitlers, the people who are consumed by evil, then why does hell even exist? If we are guaranteed to be saved even if we choose to sin, then why bother NOT sinning? Jesus himself spoke of people who were cast into the fires. You can't accept Jesus Christ as your savior and then choose to murder people. Get real, fundamentalists. God is merciful, but we are responsible for repenting. If hell exists for anyone, then surely it exists for the likes of the shooter. As a Catholic, I feel confident that he is NOT in heaven.

Posted By: Maryann | August 12, 2009 4:36 PM

Oh, please, James. The shooter needed only a woman to love him and he would not have open fired in a gym? He needed someone to give him a chance to demonstrate how he was potentially a wonderful husband for any lady? Apparently, the women he encountered sensed that something was wrong and that he did not have that potential. You, James, sound like a sexist and a woman hater yourself. No, we are not all out there looking for bad boys, no more than you guys are all out there looking for loose women. Don't try to excuse this crazy monster by saying it is OUR fault that we didn't love him. ("You were mean to him....so there...he shot you! Take that!") Sounds like you have some issues of your own to work through. Run, don't walk, to a mental health therapist.

Posted By: Maryann | August 12, 2009 4:56 PM

I've had it up to here with people like New York Times columnist Bob Herbert telling us what this means. The man who committed this crime was a sick puppy, pure and simple. Trying to determine what all this says about society is about as easy as trying to determine what Jupiter's moons have to do with the stock market. Mr. Herbert should keep his fictions to himself since the unintelligent and naive may actually believe him.

Posted By: Truthmeister | August 12, 2009 4:59 PM

I always hear from self-proclaimed nice guys that women are only interested in the bad boys, but I find that most of those guys are confusing timidity with niceness and aren't very nice at all. This is their way of blaming women for their own deficiencies, which is rather misogynistic of them. There's a woman who likes me, but I have absolutely no romantic attraction to her whatsoever. Therefore, I don't think it'd be fair to judge women for not being attracted to me even if the reason is indeed I'm too nice.
I'm willing to bet that many, if not most, misogynists consider themselves nice guys who are mistreated by women.

Even though this man was a murderer, I do have sympathy for him (and, of course, my main sympathy goes to his victims). If his mental health problems were treated, I'm sure things would have turned out differently.

Posted By: Merciel | August 12, 2009 5:15 PM

What's most striking to me in Sodini's blog writings (which I read all the way through) is his complete self-centeredness. There's never a word of sympathy or concern for anyone else. He's obsessed with women, but only as sex objects. You don't get the sense that he enjoyed people for themselves, or that he felt any desire to help others, or was saddened by other people's pain. Just me-me-me.

There are some truly nice guys who get overlooked because they lack the social skills or the looks, but I think Sodini was really pretty rotten inside.

Posted By: Nancy | August 12, 2009 5:45 PM

I agree whole-heartedly with Merciel (Sodini was a self-centered, twisted individual).

Unfortunately,James's comment that being "Saved" requires Living in Christ, which is not true EXACTLY. What the Bible tells us is that you must accept Jesus Christ as your Lord and Savior, but we will all continue to sin and that we must seek forgiveness and repentance. The sin of Sodini is great in our eyes, but a sin is a sin to God. Sodini would have had to have been truly repentent and sought forgiveness, but none of that gives you salvation. Christ gives the gift of salvation when someone seeks Him and asks for forgiveness and to be their Lord and Savior. After that, we all sin. I'm not saying it's easy to understand, but don't mislead people either.

Posted By: Beverly | August 12, 2009 6:58 PM

If you read the whole blog as posted on the ABC link, Sodini didn't consider himself a Christian at all. He trash-talks his "fundie" neighbor Andy and lusts after Andy's college-age daughter, whom he assumes is sleeping around. He has an interesting quote: "Religion has a certain stink to it of guilt, shame, fear, and that moral standard that always contradicts the natural tendencies and desires of a person." In his case, apparently, his "natural tendencies" were along the lines of shooting people at the gym...

What I get from the New York Times quote is that while Sodini acted of his own free will, he also represents the extreme conclusion of the view of society and the media that all men are entitled to women... or specifically, women who are young and conventionally attractive. In American movies and sitcoms for example, you always see nerdy or average-looking men with supermodel women but never the other way around. Sodini was obsessed with women half his age and apparently didn't consider his own peers to be "desirable." No woman finds that spoiled-brat sense of entitlement to be attractive.

Posted By: Kitty | August 12, 2009 8:08 PM

We are all responsible for what happened: the society, the church, the family. There is also a free will which he chose that leads to death. The failure of the society, family, and even the church may teach us something. Do you have a friend who acted this way? Or a neighbor, or acquaintance, that need your help? People of the church, you have known the truth & not only by words but deeds. Godbless us.

Posted By: andy padolina | August 13, 2009 12:50 AM

James says that it is, after all, the fault of women, for if we (the entire gender) would only give nice guys a chance, Sodini wouldn't have been driven to this. With his unsubstantiated statistics (many Christian women only want bad boys?), it sounds like James has the same blame-someone-else mentality. Oh, James, if only I knew you and could give you a chance to be a good husband, all your problems would be solved.

Posted By: Robyn | August 13, 2009 1:38 PM

James, this is way wrong estimation that the main problem was a woman not giving Sodini a chance to be a 'nice guy'. He had major problems that were not going to be solved by this. Moving the blame to the women around him does nothing to address what were his fundamental issues. I don't think from Sodini's mental state he was actually capable of perceiving what type of woman could realistically be good for him; instead, he believed lies perpetrated by gurus like Steele.

Posted By: carol | August 14, 2009 1:08 AM

I have read reread this guys stuff. and Then knowing he had 4 guns and 4 clips of 38 plus bullets yet they only found 56 and one gun never was used his his that killed him was used once, tells me that he tried to stop this madness, he was taking mediation, he knew he had somethng but did he ever go see a dr. probably not. Because is is of my generation when we did not talk about this sort of issue. Keep it clamed up. Then the face he turned off the lights. had he wanted to do more harm he would have left them on and picked off more ppl effectively. IN the end most the wounds were minor and and lower. not higher. He got lucky 3 times. He chickened out once. A victim repots he stood ther for a minute before he turned off the lights. He had a second thought but then it was too late. He knew he would wound but not kill that many. He simply wanted his pain to stop.

Posted By: CC | August 14, 2009 4:52 PM

He got his reward: hell

Posted By: Jan | August 16, 2009 9:28 PM

This man was CRAZY, plain and simple. He was at best a heretic and at worse a non-believer. He broke every commandment the Lord ever gave to His people in both the Old and New Testaments. His behavior was inexcusable. The Lord Jesus set an rule by which we judge believers:"By their fruits, you will know them."
Can the believers , who are making excuses for this man, truthfully say that he measured up to the standard by which everyone one of us will one day be judged?

Posted By: junia | August 17, 2009 12:45 PM

Anybody can claim "I'm saved." Yes, once a person is truly saved, they are always saved. But many many people think walking the aisle, getting wet in the baptistry, and getting your name on the church role will do it. If you are saved, you will have given Jesus your whole life forever. That leaves out committing mass murder. I know an ex-preacher who cusses and verbally abuses his family, merely tolerates saying grace, hasn't attended church in many years, periodically persecutes wife and kids for their beliefs, has practically disowned oldest child who is in seminary; but according to him, churches are worldly and spiritually dead, wife is a hypocrit and unsubmissive, his kids are brainwashed by his wife, and he is Mr. Super-Christian. We Christians need to learn our faith is to be lived if it is real. And all of us need to learn that people who portray themselves as perpetual victims are not truly seeing themselves at all. Incidently, to those who think Christian women are interested in "bad boys." A few may be, but far more fall for someone who puts on a good act and she doesn't see the real man until after the wedding.

Posted By: Elizabeth | August 17, 2009 5:37 PM

Misogny, misandry.... in USA...it's always about sex...and the guy from New Yor Times is an american apologist...give it a break... this guy was sick and disturbed... period.. and the great business enterprise that Christianty is in USA, even it failed him....

Nobody is sav-ED. Salvation is an on going process. Those who are saved here on earth are in mega-churches or stadiums doling out their cash for the mega-pastors (entertainers i call them) to live it up...

Posted By: Alan | August 19, 2009 12:17 AM

This case is a great example of the bad fruit of Protestantism. The killer wrote in his blog that his pastor was always preaching that salvation is not based on our works, that nothing we can do on this earth can please God but that our salvation is based on our Faith Alone. That's basic Protestant doctrine. In most people, it simply results in apathy and spiritual arrogance. But when taken to its logical conclusion- antinomianism- some people who are sorely tempted to some sinful deed look deeply into themselves and see no reason not to act on their impulses. "Hey, it's not like I can go to Hell- I'm saved/predestined! I'm only human. I believe in Jesus- He'll forgive me." Also, since he attended a non-denominational (read Pentecostal) church, one can only imagine the psychological and spiritual abuse he endured there. And can someone tell me what the heck being in heaven but not enjoying his rewards actually means???

Posted By: Phil | August 25, 2009 3:18 PM

I'm surprised no one in these comments has mentioned the role of upbringing. I'd be willing to bet that he was in some way abused by his parents/guardians. Not everyone who's abused commits these kinds of acts, but most everyone who commits mass murders has abuse in their background. Parents are responsible for giving us the emotional tools to deal with life and when those tools are broken or destroyed, we have no point of reference. This doesn't excuse his behavior at all because he's still responsible as an adult, but parents need to be held accountable as well. When a child feels loved and safe in the world, they don't grow up to commit such horrible acts.

Posted By: CHEERY | September 1, 2009 2:17 PM

The son he may have fathered was to have a dna test. The supposed son had taken his whole pic of the net and made it smaller and now there is a larger but skewed pic. but he sure looks and has the funny mouth and jaw Sodini had. A unique jaw and mouth. Looks like him jaw and eys. I did some reseach om this, found more of his website searches. Found people who knew himl. The women did indeed feel either odd about him he had a stutter, you can see in his vidl. A kid who lived 3 doors from him came foward and said his mom and bro was indeed mean to him. Most were back in the day for any kid with special needs especially stuttering. The guy his my age. Not a compassionate time people..... But he did keep trying women. He tried to get help and was trying new churchs and self help. I figured out what and why he made his vids. Stupid people he followed of the steel balls. But he did exactly as they said. He was a literal thinker and he had a hard time seeing the gray area of life most of us learn. He had a good sense of humor. He did not want so much sex but to just have a human contact a human touch. For him, it was like this, for 2 he was sliding down a hill trying to grab on to every rock tree and shurb he could but without the adivce he wrote about he had not support and there would be no help for him. If his son is his son he has only a day or two to make a claim to his possible fathers assets before the victims do.

Posted By: awatcher | September 7, 2009 9:23 PM

I came across this today. his church did know he was suffereing from depression. Probably this, dysthemia, and he had out of whack blood glucose levels. He posted this info online. Those two alone left untreatd can give a person anger and rage.

What kind of church turns away from a person in need?

The man who shot three women to death at a health club Tuesday was once a member of a church that is in the process of relocating from Plum to New Kensington.

George Sodini, who killed three women and wounded nine others before taking his own life in a Collier fitness center, said in his online blog he was a member of the Tetelestai Christian Church, 813 Pierson Run Road, for 13 years.

The congregation is in the midst of renovating the former Terrace Elementary School/ Westmoreland County Community College branch on East Hills Drive. The church recently closed a $270,000 purchase of the property and plans to relocate there.

Sodini apparently stopped attending church functions three years ago and expressed disillusionment with religion. He also made derogatory references to the Tetelestai pastor, the Rev. Alan "Rick" Knapp.

"Holy [expletive], religion is a waste. But this guy teaches (and convinced me) you can commit mass murder then still go to heaven. Ask him," Sodini wrote, adding Knapp's home address in Oakmont and phone number to the posting.

"In any case," the posting continued, "guilt and fear kept me there 13 long years until November 2006. I think his crap did the most damage."

The Valley News Dispatch and Tribune-Review News Service visited Knapp's home, the present Plum church site and the new site in New Kensington in an attempt to discuss Sodini, but were unsuccessful in finding Knapp. Several telephone messages went unreturned.

A secretary at the New Kensington site, where workmen were busy making renovations to the former community college building, said Knapp was supposed to release a statement through the church's attorney.

Messages left for the church's attorney, David Toll, were not returned.

The secretary, who identified herself only as Kathy, declined to say where the pastor was or how he could be reached.

Kathy said she did not know Sodini and questioned if he really was a member of the church.

One person who did speak to Rev. Knapp, 58, was Oakmont Police Chief David DiSanti Sr.

DiSanti said the minister contacted police Wednesday morning after learning his name and address were in Sodini's writings The chief said Knapp was badly shaken.

"Rev. Knapp said he had genuine concerns for the welfare of himself and his family," DiSanti said. Knapp later met with DiSanti and Allegheny County homicide Detective Henry Siemianowski for about 45 minutes at the Oakmont police station.

"(Knapp) in no way, shape or form condones any type of activity like this. Like many mentally ill people, (Sodini) misconstrued what he said and took something out of context," DiSanti said. "Rev. Knapp never, ever made any inference that a person could commit mass murder and still go to heaven.

DiSanti said borough police have never had any previous contact with Knapp, who has lived in Oakmont since 1993.

"The first time I met him was today, and I think he's a pretty stand-up individual," DiSanti said.

Attempts also were made to contact church members, Deacon Charles Matone of Greensburg and Arnie Caffas of Verona, but neither returned repeated telephone calls.

At Wednesday evening's regular prayer meeting and Bible study at the church in Plum, several people arrived in cars, however, none acknowledged knowing Sodini and would not give their names. Several cars slowed at the driveway, but left when they spotted reporters standing there.

Posted By: cherry | September 21, 2009 7:23 PM